Question

[eviltigerlily.livejournal.com]

Well, sort of. I see there's been some discussion lately regarding VIII and Rimmer in particular, which I er... missed. And well... There is this thing in BITR that always bothered me. In the trial scene the posse have to sign a consent form to be tried by mind probe using psychotropic drugs, but Rimmer never does. Can that be legal? Without Rimmer's trial they would have nothing on the rest either. Personally I believe they have been wrongfully imprisoned. They should be released immedately!

*glances up*
I will go quietly away now.

Comments

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

True. True. Although there has to be someone the Canaries respect enough to lead them in some semblance of order.

Although one wonders what would happen if the Canaries knew what was going on. Would they rebel?

BTW, I think Toddhunter would be next in line?

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

Todhunter isn't in VIII. I think the nanobots were choosy in who they resurrected - Kochanski I and Todhunter weren't there... Maybe the nanobots were careful to keep the competent dead.

Although there has to be someone the Canaries respect enough to lead them in some semblance of order.

Why? They're convicted criminals, and mostly alpha males. Prison riots in the past have mainly been that, riots, without any one central leader being able to take control.

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

Because they generally go down into dangerous situations in some sort of order? I'm basing it on their actions during their drops, not a theoretical riot.

Also, about Todhunter... Peterson isn't shown but it's implied he still exists, perhaps Todhunter is still around too, just not visibly because they couldn't hire the actor back for whatever reason.

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

They do run missions, but they're generally chaotic. Our people (Lister, Rimmer, Kryten, Cat, Kochanski) are organized, but they're quite different from the rest of the prisoners. The missions on the part of the rest are more along the lines of Kill Crazy yelling, "Let's kiiiiillll something!" and knocking himself out on a door.

Yep, exactly - they put in a stand-in for Petersen, but not for Todhunter. That's why I figgered he just wasn't there.

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

They had a stand-in for Peterson? I thought he was just never *in* a scene.

I think if people started dissapearing off the main crew, there would be more then a few questions.

But then, that makes for an interesting plot bunny.

Also, the missions seem to be somewhat organized. In "Cassandra" we had Knots going around and telling the Canaries that there was flooding on the upper decks. Plus, the Canaries tend to organize themselves into fireteams of five or less. Just judging from the Time wand episode.

Although there is still KillCrazy's chaotic element there too.

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

The third fellow in the gas mask in the return-to-RD scene. The cast said in the commentary and in the documentary that it was meant to be a standin for Petersen, as they couldn't get the guy. (Probably too busy with Harry Potter.)

Not if the Nanobots modified the computer's memory banks and the memories of the crew. Why not? If they can resurrect everyone and everything from dust, they can do that much.

I assumed Knott was a guard; he was wearing a different vest from the rest. There were well-armed guards in the Ackerman-addresses-the-Canaries scenes; you'd assume they were in the same boat as Ackerman. Hires who have a lot to lose.

IMO, they are organized by the powers that be (Ackerman and the guards) into groups of five or fewer, not self-organized - indeed, organized just so that they're kept from whatever little chance is left of organizing. Like chain gangs, or current prison work details.

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

Ah, okay.

You would be right with your assumption that Knott was a guard. He's listed as "Warden Knot" in the credits. (Which doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense really.)

However if the Canaries allow themselves to be ordered about and organized by Ackerman, could he not also take over Red Dwarf in some sort of coup?

As for Peterson having a stand in, I didn't think that was, literally, supposed to be Peterson, since Lister's other friends tell Lister that Peterson was too drunk to come.

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

Ah, but either way - if he was too drunk to come (will not make slashy comments), then he was aboard the ship.

They follow Ackerman because Ackerman has control over them. But his control depends on the guards and on the prisoner's physical incarceration (one assumes that he has the ability to, for instance, take away their food, or keep their lights on all night). If he gives them freedom, they would have no reason to follow him. Can you see the warden of a current prison raising an army of gas station robbers, rapists, and only slightly sane murderers?

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

Oh, I agree that Ackerman would never do it. I'm just theorizing about weither or not it would be believable for Hollister to be threated by a _potential_ Ackerman coup.

Do you think they'd be transporting Rapists as well? I'd imagine that would present some logistical problems since they would most likely have to be isolated from the rest of the convict population.

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

Nah. Hollister's canny. He'd know that Ackerman isn't in a good position to threaten him.

They already segregate men and women in the living areas. I don't see why not.

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

Usually rapists are segregated from the general prison population because they are likely to be targeted by the other inmates.

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

Are they? I couldn't find any refs online to standard practice, and I'd think that would be prohibitive in terms of space.

[typhonblue.livejournal.com]

Hm. I don't think it's prohibitive in terms of space. Supermax facilities are set up to have a large precentage of beds that used for single convicts in isolation.

I've heard from various sources that rapists are often isolated due to them being picked out by the rest of the population and assaulted or killed.

I'd have to try to trace my internet steps to find them though. Which may mean I can't.

[roadstergal.livejournal.com]

I've heard that for child molesters, but not rapists in general. Then again, I've tried to minimize the time I spend in prison.

[eviltigerlily.livejournal.com]

I would think it more likely for mutiny to arise within the crew. They are bound to realize that as there isno JMC anymore, Hollister doesn't have any real aouthority anymore.