reddwarfslash | Head Canons And Lister's Sexuality

We all have them, but some are more deeply entrenched than others. The recent plethora of BDSM fic (thank you, Kronette and Felineranger) made me realise that I have problems imagining Lister as a natural, dyed in the wool submissive, which *spoiler* is a major aspect of "Lessons In Heroics", even though it's an alternate version of him.

(Kronette, this is not a criticism of your fic in any way. You can write whatever the hell you like and I'm finding the story riveting regardless.) :)

Those who are following this story will know that, on the list of disquieting aspects, an alternate version of Lister being an enthusiastic sub is so far down it shouldn't even register, but somehow it does for me. I think it's because his usual character is so anti rules and regulations that it's hard to imagine BDSM being a fundamental part of his sexuality. Which isn't to say I can't see him enjoying it (as in "FSOS") but enjoying and needing are different.

I apologise in advance if my ramblings offend anyone. I don't mean to imply that there's anything wrong with being a natural sub or Dom, just that it's not how I interpret his character. I can imagine either of Rimmer though.

Does anyone else have head canons which you thought were casual until you read a fic which contradicted them?

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Oh, here's another, very boring one: It's always DAVID Lister, to me. Not Dave. That may be my background; we don't use abbreviated names in Scandinavia; if you learn that someone's name is a particular thing, it feels odd to refer to them as anything else. But I don't think it's that; not really (I use an abbreviation for my own name with English speakers, so you know...) - I think it's more that "Dave" feels like something someone who doesn't know him well enough would assume he wants to be called. It makes sense for Holly to call him that, but notably, Petersen doesn't. Again, that could be related to the above, but, well. That's a deep-set fanon/headcanon thing for me; I would never consider having Rimmer call him Dave. :p

I usually don't have Rimmer call him Dave (although I did in an AU fic where they were married), but only because I think of him as Lister first and I think Rimmer does too. The moment where he calls him Dave in "Marooned" does rather back up your theory.

Although I'm trying to remember whether Chen or Selby ever call him Dave. I always thought Petersen didn't because English isn't his first language...

Doesn't Lister refer to himself as Dave? Other people...I think Chen/Selby calls him Dave in Back in the Red, and Kochanski2 always calls him Dave, which he accepts (and there's "Will you stop calling your boyfriend Dave? I'M Dave. He's the anti-Lister."). Whether Rimmer would call him Dave...eh. In a romantic context, I see it working as a sporadic pet name.

Well, like I said to Vero below, it's not really about which name he is most often called, or even which name he claims to prefer. It's more about what I feel the names represent in different contexts. And as you point out, who says it matters too.

Book!canon suggests that he prefers Dave. In Last Human he tells Kochanski not to call him David. It also tends to be how he refers to himself throughout the show.

That isn't really the impression I was left with, but then again, like I said below, it's not really about frequency of usage; it's about what I feel the names represents. What I'm getting at is that "Dave Lister" is a slightly different person, in Lister's mind, than "David Lister" and he likes and dislikes both, for various reasons. But to me, "David Lister" is closer to who he "really" is. That's a terrible explanation, lol.

While canon suggests "Dave" is preferred, to be fair, it also suggests "Arnold" is preferred ... and I just can't do it. I much prefer Arn or Arnie, or something else. Especially since I write mainly romance-related with the character. "Arnold" is about as sexy and appealing as dish soap. (People named Arnold can calm the hell right down, because I feel the same way about "Gary" since it's my dad's name.)

I was struggling to formulate a reply to all of the above, and here you go, taking the words right out of my mouth. This isn't really about looking at canonical evidence of who calls him what and how often, it's more a gut feeling based on the impressions I've gotten from the show in general.

Also, it's not really about what Lister prefers to be called, but rather what I feel the names represent to him consciously or not. And who says it matters. I'm not sure if that's any clearer than what Vero said much more succinctly. :p

I can't think of them calling one another anything but Lister and Rimmer. Maybe it's unrealistic especially since I know Rimmer doesn't like his last name, but I just can't HEAR them any other way. My fanwank explanation for my own fics is that Rimmer loves Lister so much that he actually starts to LIKE how his name sounds when it comes from Lister's lips. :D

No, I do that too. It's not unrealistic at all; it's what they call one another, it's their names for one another. Names are important, and interesting (to me, certainly, as I'm sure is overtly evident by now :p). Lister calling Rimmer "Rimmer" is different from other people calling him that. That's even lampshaded in canon; "Rimmer, to rhyme with scum." And I suppose, to Rimmer, reclaiming something that was forced upon him - his name - might be a good thing. I personally don't think Rimmer minds either way what people call him, TBH. So long as it's actually his name. ;)

Well, Rimmer does call him David after being drained in "Polymorph."

Oh, and then Davy-Boy in Emohawk! A LOT. (I'm sorry, but the way being "Ace" gives Rimmer leave to fawn and hover over Lister with such unabashed adoration in Emohawk will forever be one of my favorite things about Series 6, LOL.)

Edited 2014-10-08 20:21 (UTC)

Roadstergal took that to its logical conclusion in this fic, which you've no doubt read but I'll link to it here anyway as it's way back in the archives and there's bound to be someone who hasn't. http://www.roadstergal.info/misc/ace.htm

I'll have to watch those scenes in "Emohawk" again and count the endearments. :D

It really is adorable! And just a bit scary how quick Rimmer is to sacrifice himself (and Cat!) to spare Lister getting attacked by the Emohawk.

Just echoing this. And Lister's returning, "What a guy!" adoration back at Ace. :D

Head Canons And Lister's Sexuality

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