Rimmer Versus Ace

[janamelie.livejournal.com]

No, not in the popularity stakes - I realise Rimmer's the overwhelming winner on here just as Ace is the overwhelming winner onscreen.  But to what extent does Lister actually want him to be like Ace?

There's no doubt IMO that Lister is infatuated with Ace in "DJ" and would probably have slept with him if circumstances had allowed it.  But that doesn't necessarily mean he's responding so much to Ace as an individual, more to an underlying attraction which was always there but suppressed by Rimmer's personality and latterly his soft-light status.  Of course part of it is the effect which Ace has on most people.

I personally think that the events of "DJ" plant the idea in Rimmer's head that Lister will always go weak at the knees for Ace and that he's in permanent competition with him.  This can only have been reinforced by Lister pushing him to become Ace in "SMAC" even though I perceive Lister as genuinely thinking that he was doing the right thing both for Rimmer and for the multiverse.  I believe he thought that becoming a hero would be the making of Rimmer.

When he dreams of Rimmer's return in "Blue" the man he pictures is neither the real Rimmer nor Ace, but something in between which suggests even he may not be sure which he prefers.  What do the rest of you think?

Comments

[rosecathy1.livejournal.com]

See, for the sake of Rimmer's emotional health, I always want to write Lister as not wanting Rimmer to be Ace and in fact thinking that Ace is over-the-top. He did concede in SMAC that Ace is a bit full of himself and that Rimmer could (should?) be a different kind of Ace. On the other hand, his admiration for Ace in DJ is so obvious and unchecked. You could argue, I suppose, that his views change over the next few series, and of course Rimmer changes too and has a few brave moments. The one Lister sees in the dream might be a Rimmer who's improved all by himself rather than an Ace-ified Rimmer, if that makes sense.

Buuut on Rimmer's side...the angst potential! The "in permanent competition with Ace" idea is seriously all I think about when I'm concocting angsty fic scenarios. I think Rimmer doesn't want to see himself and Ace as the same person, but he can't ignore the similarities or the thought that if he had fulfilled his potential, if he were even just a little bit better, he would be good enough for Lister. He can't become Kochanski or Lise Yates or whoever else from Lister's past; he could have become Ace, or at least more Ace-like, except now it's too late. 💔

[janamelie.livejournal.com]

I personally think that it's somewhere in between i.e. Lister wishes Rimmer was easier to get on with and brought people up instead of bringing them down. As a natural optimist like him I strongly empathise.

I think some of his reaction in "DJ" is definitely the novelty factor plus, I suspect, he's completely taken back by the force of his sexual attraction to this version of Rimmer. It's only natural that the Rimmer he sees every day is going to come off even worse than usual in comparison. But once Ace is gone it has to set him thinking about how if he can be attracted to one version of Rimmer, why not another?

It does indeed have endless angst potential but someone needs to point out to Rimmer that in Lister's dream he removed the wig straight away and only then did Lister kiss him. I say someone; obviously I mean Lister. ;)