Fathers and Suns notices ...

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

I watched the second episode again and had a couple of thoughts.

First, I don't find it that odd that Rimmer would have a breast fixation. We know from little clues he likes, um, larger features on the ladies (the rude Renaissance paintings from the first novel; his remarks about big thighs in "Memory" to name two). I can reconcile him being gay and still fascinated with women's bodies - he certainly wouldn't be the first gay man I've known to like boobs. Most seem to.

Second, a bit of costumey - anyone glimpse the little horizontal pleating on the sides of Rimmer's tunic at waist level? Nice detail, is all.

Finally, did anyone else notice Rimmer putting that hardlight strength to work with the forklifts at the end? The others were trying to push them off one at a time, but Rimmer was visibly straining in the back - one hand on each, holding them off the entire group until Lister made Pree shut down. You can even see Rimmer lowering his arms afterward. Quite a switch from his Rimmerworld runner (from a purely survivalist POV, Rimmer could've gone to softlight here and his bee wouldn't have been hurt at all, even if the others had been spiked or crushed).

No wonder Rimmer did a little dance with the others after; aww, he helped!

In that vein, I feel like the boys are all more cohesive and affectionate - family-like - this season, than ever before, and concerned about one another. Maybe that's what many people like about X so far, I don't know.

Comments

[felineranger.livejournal.com]

I get a strong feeling of that too and I think it stems partly from the cast and partly from the writing. In the commentary for BTE Robert mentions how much he loves the early scene of them all in the bunk room for that very reason - I can't remember the exact quote but he makes reference to them being a family.
I loved a comment from Craig in one of the recent interviews as well, saying about how close they've all become over the years and now 'we finish each others sentences'. So cute and lovely!

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

I do think Doug likes a familial feel more than Rob did; reading Rob's solo novels, I got a feeling of isolation for each character except in a few instances (which were more powerful when employed). Even in Backwards each character feels sort of isolated in dealing with their own problems or neuroses (and Ace is the ultimate loner).

I rewatched Tikka the other day and was struck by how different Rimmer was from even Series 6, under just Doug's writing. You could argue it's natural progression, but I think he'd have been different if Rob had still been on board...

[hazeltea.livejournal.com]

The thing about Rimmer is that he doesn't have enough practical experience with women to know what he likes, so he defaults to what society says is attractive; sort of like teenage boys do. You can tell that by the way he talks about McGruder. When he met Nirvanah, he liked her because for the first time someone else was treating him as a person in a relationship and not a generic piece of a relationship, and she certainly didn't have double Ds!

I'm glad I'm not the only one who sqeed over those pleats!

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

Camille's form certainly wasn't busty - it was his sister-in-law, still attractive, so I do see what you mean. Being a model, she's someone he'd think he's supposed to swoon over. Of course here, it's mainly just a comedy device to get Rimmer to be a stand-in for the shallow male viewer, and I was highly amused. (It's easy for me to forget sometimes things are done on this show for comedy's sake and/or to hit a comic trope that will get laughs and ratings, LOL.)

[hazeltea.livejournal.com]

Absolutely about the model comment. Another thing about Camille, too, is that she was desirable to him because he had a chance to possess something is brother "owned" (again, issues with women!) and it was a way of scoring off his brother, even if it was only his sister in law in image and not reality. It would still be a status symbol to him because the Space Corps Captain he wants to be WOULD have a model for a girlfriend, of course! lol

[kms726.livejournal.com]

I was saying to my brother just the other day how it feels like the Red Dwarf boys have a family-unit feel now. I never really got that vibe before. Four guys trapped together who became friends, maybe--but not family. They're tighter now, more close-knit. Like how they helped Rimmer try to pull off that stunt to impress Howard without a kerfuffle (not that we saw, at least). They saw Rimmer wanted their help and they just did it. I love this new group dynamic and I hope we see more of it :)

Also, Rimmer's dance in the end of F&S--adorkable! :) someone made a lovely gif of it : http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mc04vuRmez1qeak7z.gif

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

That's the biggest thing, how they're working together to help each other and sort of look after each other. Cat getting into the drab gray onesie to help Rimmer play captain - now there might well have been a bribe involved we don't see, but it's still a far cry from C&P when Lister was collapsed, sick, and Rimmer couldn't talk him away from his lunch to help pick him up.

And as for Rimmer, compare being squeezed by spiked forklifts to the relative ease of blasting someone in the back in Rimmerworld, which he DIDN'T do. It's a subtle shift for both him and Cat; hell, there was even a time Lister wouldn't have played along for Howard like he did here.

[hazeltea.livejournal.com]

Right on all counts :)

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

Also, I forgot, I think it was Metalkatt who pointed out to me, it's unlikely Lister got himself into that shopping cart and pillowed his own head alone. And where were the empty shot glasses in quarters? (I didn't see them, at least.) Plus, it's unlikely "Dad" would've gotten away with that recording in quarters late at night with Rimmer there. She said Rimmer probably found him passed out elsewhere, tipped him into the cart, and wheeled him back to quarters.

Sure, maybe Kryten did instead, but you just know if HE had, he would've maneuvered Dave into bed to be more comfortable. Whereas, Rimmer's concerned, but still enough of a bastard to leave him in the cart. :-D

[janamelie.livejournal.com]

I've seen the victory dance described as unnecessary and even embarrassing, but I strongly disagree. It is adorkable. :)

The boys from the Dwarf have never been bothered about what's appropriate - well, Rimmer has, but he's clearly loosened up. ;)

[janamelie.livejournal.com]

I didn't notice Rimmer using his strength at the end - I'll have to watch the ep again. What a hardship. ;)

I agree about the family feeling, although Cat's still selfish enough to hog all the anaesthetic. But that's Cat, I suppose.

I wonder if Ep 4 sees some kind of row between Rimmer and Lister which might explain the latter's rather blase attitude to losing Rimmer in a poker game. And indeed the fact of him betting his bunkmate in the first place.

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

Did you rewatch for the forklift scene? ;-)

Regarding the next episode - the synopsis says the groinal exploder will detonate if Lister doesn't pay up in 24 hours, right? He appears to have bet Starbug and Rimmer, I think - so what's the problem? If he hands over Rimmer, he's safe. If he's not safe, it may stand to reason it's because he really isn't prepared to hand Rimmer over to satisfy the bet ... I'm just speculating, man. :-D

[pebblerocker]

Deb Lister is "the one with the juicy jugs" to Rimmer and she doesn't fit into the stereotypical model type of attractiveness. Though of course there could be something about her which appeals to Rimmer and the fact that she has breasts makes it all right for him to say so without harming his image.

[janamelie.livejournal.com]

That had honestly never occurred to me. Interesting. :D

[pebblerocker]

Perfect icon! How often do you have one from the exact episode under discussion?

Rimmer's self-loathing is a given; we don't need his reaction to Arlene to tell us about it. That he sees Deb as sexually attractive despite her slobbiness I think says something about his repressed feelings for his Lister.

[janamelie.livejournal.com]

I rarely have such an appropriate icon tbh. All credit for making it to Roadstergal. :)

I completely agree with your theory re Rimmer's attraction to Deb. Plot bunnies! ;)

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

I like the way you think ...

[nice-girls-play.livejournal.com]

I wasn't overly distracted with Rimmer's specs for the new computer -- I figure, like a lot of gay men and people in general, what he likes and what he'll tell Kryten he likes are two different things.

And I hadn't thought about that with the forklifts! I love our boy. He's come a long way, hasn't he?

[veronica-rich.livejournal.com]

Yes! And in this week's ep, he's come even further. You'll see ...